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Dhananjay Nene’s free (as in free speech) opinions on all things related to Software Engineering
This is not a post in defense of outsourcing. However every so often I come across a rant like Why Outsourcing Sucks and much as I emotionally connect to such posts which talk about poor software quality, I find the rant and the underlying thoughts a highly misguided exercise. This post attempts t
... Continue reading »
11 months ago
Will continue reading this blog.
11 months ago
Hope this might have projected outsourcing from a different angle.
Dhananjay
11 months ago
Saying "outsourcing" sucks is akin to saying, "software companies suck". The statement makes no sense - are you talking about Microsoft, or Apple, or Infosys, or HSBC software, or Xerox PARC, or AirTight networks, or the small budding startups in Pune?
Some models of outsourcing suck.
Some models are great.
And there is no reason to simplify it by attaching a single label.
11 months ago
Not sure if your comment is directed at this post or the one it was referring to. I have actually not attached a label to outsourcing .. instead have explored the economic dynamics around it and the fact that it is perhaps not such a well understood process and it is our understanding of it that sometimes sucks (ie. it is often so casually maligned).
10 months ago
I did want to point out the fact that there are different models of engagement. This issue is a little orthogonal to your analysis. I meant it as something else to think about, in addition to what you said.
How the outsourcer and outsourcee interact makes a huge difference to the final outcome.
Do you send over detailed specs and just want them implemented, or do you send over a high level concept and outsource the architectural thinking too? Or do you also involve the outsourcee in roadmap evolution details?
What is the incentive structure in place? Bonus for delivery on deadline? By number of bugs fixed? At the other end of the spectrum is that the outsourcee has equity in the outsourcer!
Which side of Venkat's Impossibility Triangle are you playing in?
What are you really looking for? Junior programmers who can learn on the job? Or experienced and/or the best of the best? Like.com was looking for the latter and decided that in this case the cost advantage that India had was not enough to overcome the overheads.
If you were setting up a local (non-outsourced) team, you wouldn't evaluate it purely on economic terms. You would be worrying about all the above factors, and more. And the success of your team would depend upon which point you chose on each of those spectrums. Same is true of outsourcing too.
The different ways of outsourcing are different points (or technically, clusters of points) in a multi-dimensional space. Treating them all alike is over-simplification - good for headlines ("Outsourcing sucks"), but bad for understanding them and making best use of them. I guess, I am just elaborating another way in which "Outsourcing does not suck. Our understanding of it does."
11 months ago
There have been a deluge of posts and rants about outsourcing recently. While I agree that there are some genuine reasons for it having a bad reputation, there are some great freelancers and outsourcing companies out there who do a fantastic job.
The arguments for different time zones, cultural differnences etc. are moot in my opinion - those are all known facts which can be easily dealt with. In my experience, problems with outsourced projects tend to be caused largely by the buyer - wanting to save money, and not taking the time to research and communicate with their freelancers properly.
I've outsourced a number of projects over the past year and been very happy with most of the results. When there has been a problem I'm realised that it was mainly a breakdown of communication, and largely my fault, and I've learned from it.
Ranting and complaining about outsourcing, as so many people seem to at the moment, won't help - it's here to stay! So all parties should endevour to learn, improve and turn outsourcing into the valid and respected business it should be.
11 months ago
I think this is unequivocally false. It might hold true for making physical widgets, but in my experience software quality (and productivity) is a direct consequence of the talent and knowledge level of the programmer.
The most serious problem I have found in working with an outsourced programming team is that the contracting firm has little visibility into the makeup and selection of the team. Usually, if you contract a ten person team from the average Mumbai outsourcing shop, their team lead will be a pretty decent programmer and there will be two or three guys who are satisfactory, but the rest will be a net drag on your productivity.
A bad programmer produces less work, and that work is inferior: more bugs, poor structure, slow algorithms... Code review (which is absolutely essential when working with outsourced teams) takes a lot longer, and you need more rounds of it. Past a certain point the drag on the technical leadership will become prohibitive.
If your process discipline is not 100% (and for most small software companies, it isn't), those guys on the left-hand side of the bell curve are going to slip some grotesque, monstrous logic errors into your programs.
I think there's definitely a market in Canada and in the U.S. for "creme de la creme" outsourcing teams: people two to three sigma right of centre on the talent curve, highly productive programmers with MSc.-level computer science backgrounds, who are at least somewhat familiar with Unix (I've found that most Indian programmers aren't).
The traditional draw of outsourcing to India has been that you can get a programmer for 30%-50% of what you'd have to pay one here. If we had it to do again, I think we'd gladly pay double or triple that salary to get a smaller team of really exceptional people.
11 months ago
Without attempting to characterize your experiences (and I am certain yours is a very valid experience as are likely to be many other different ones), one of the issues I have indeed pointed out is a reduction in average skill levels and the economic drivers which are leading to that.
I think a customer who is not satisfied with the service, should change providers. But to imagine that you cannot find people two to three sigma right of the centre on talent curve in India is unlikely to be accurate. You'll certainly find them if you look hard enough (I would like to believe I have worked with scores of such people myself both in US and in India).
With regards to engineering processes, there are firms which will have rigorous training and mentoring capabilities to ramp up the skill levels, and there are many who dont. You will find all kinds of firms in all corners of the world. Caveat Emptor would be my operating advice.
Dhananjay
11 months ago
10 months ago
From my experience, there are sure good people in the programming team, but most of them are scattered throughout different providers and different teams. Most of the setup is just as what Greg mention, a capable team lead, followed by few other capable team members and the rest are just net drag. I am not saying that every team is like this, but even with big providers, they tend not to put all their eggs in one basket, and they will handle the risk by distributing their top talents rather than keeping them as one team.
And to find top talents are sure is a problem in the market. If all you depends are top talents, then its going to be very hard to bill the client and meet your sales target. This is what I believe IMHO to be the reason for such exercise (of distributing talents and just keep adding people in the team even if it can be a drag).
I would just say, that the system work for the providers that way. Anybody considering outsourcing, just need to shop a bit harder I suppose.
10 months ago
10 months ago
9 months ago